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  • edzieba - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Sounds almost like moving the charge controller from the battery package to the charger (or rather, overriding the charge controller in the pack when using a compatible charger). Could make the use of poor quality chargers even more dangerous if it's implemented wrong: an unscrupulous manufacturer could decide "let's ramp up to 20V faster for longer, because more volts means faster charging!" and cause battery fires. Sure, no Qualcom certified charger would do this, but it's not the certified chargers that are the problem.
    Maybe Qualcom is doing some secure handshaking with a 'certified' charge controller before allowing the voltage control to be handed off the the charger, but that sounds like even more of a pain than the MFI program.
  • aakash_sin - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    +1
  • kspirit - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Your comments makes a scary amount of sense. Another +1
  • extide - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    No there will always be a pack level protection circuit, and a phone level charge controller on top of this. If the voltage goes outside of spec it will just stop charging. I mean this is going to be one of the first considerations in the design of ALL of these components. Not an issue.
  • toyotabedzrock - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    That would be nice if manufacturers like LG didn't refuse to sell batteries to technically skilled people and instead leave us to try and hope that guy on Amazon or EBAY actually is selling an OEM part.
  • extide - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Yeah that stuff you buy on ebay/amazon is not going to be OEM but I have bought lots of those cheapo replacement batteries and so far have never seen one without a protection circuit inside the battery itself.
  • III-V - Wednesday, September 16, 2015 - link

    I repair cell phones for a living. Neither Ebay nor Amazon is where you should be looking for OEM parts -- that's where you look for bottom of the barrel garbage, because you value paying somewhat less over having a quality part.

    Use a dedicated cell phone part place like ETrade Supply. You pay more, but you'll actually get decent stuff.
  • DanNeely - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Fortunately control remains with the device being charged not the power brick. From Qualcomm's press release (linked at the foot of the article):

    How does it work? Quick Charge 3.0 employs Intelligent Negotiation for Optimum Voltage (INOV), an algorithm which allows your portable device to determine what power level to request at any point in time, enabling optimum power transfer while maximizing efficiency.
  • JKJK - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    It took like forever from quick charge 2.0 was implemented in phones to chargers was actually on the market. I hope the timing is better this time.
  • aryonoco - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Someone needs to do some proper tests to see the effects of all these quick charging on battery's longevity.
  • melgross - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    It's been done. It shortens the life of the battery. This really isn't in question. It eventually destroys the anode.

    Auto manufacturers are very aware of this problem for their electric vehicles. Quick charging, which is a user requirement for cars is a major problem. There are lithium batteries that are designed to minimize this problem, but they are expensive, and no phone manufacturer uses them.

    Tesla uses off the shelf medium priced Panasonic batteries for its cars. I wonder how well they'll hold up, as I've been reading of some problems in that area.
  • id4andrei - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    From Semi On, the Qualcomm Product Manager answering question in the thread:

    "We do actually include some new tech in QC3 for extending battery cycle life, but the really important part is what the battery is designed and rated for. If it's rated at 1C or 1.5C or 2C, that means they are guaranteeing full cycle life at that power level. The handset manufacturer programs that current level into our charger and we adjust on the fly to provide it given a bunch of variables. It will never deliver more than what the handset has programmed in based on the battery's capability."

    No, it does not shorten the life of the battery. Qualcomm engineers are not stupid to do this.
  • melgross - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Yeah, it actually does. Remember Qualcomm came out with the 810 chip. Not everything they do is great.
  • jospoortvliet - Wednesday, September 16, 2015 - link

    Of course it shortens battery life, but it isn't so bad if you do it right: keep temperature in check and trickle charge the last 20%.
  • III-V - Wednesday, September 16, 2015 - link

    Until you provide a source for your claims -- no, they do not. A lot of people would be interested in reading such a view.
  • lilmoe - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    "and will work over USB, including new connector designs like USB Type-C as the USB protocol is not the same as physical connector design"

    I find this a big confusing. Did the previous QC 2.0 have a limitation on the physical connector? I thought it was only misinformation...
  • neo_1221 - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    It's not worded very well, but I think he's just emphasizing that the connector doesn't matter - it's all the same USB protocol.
  • Morawka - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    hopefully next year will be the year of android with all $400 and up flagship phones using Type C Charging Ports and Custom Designed Kyro CPU cores from qualcomm.
  • hans_ober - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Seriously. i remember a test where they checked the expansion of the lg g2 as it charged with different currents.. it was something like almost a 0.5mm expansion as it cycled, although this was less with a slower charger.
  • extide - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Yeah sounds about right, I mean that's basic physics. That is always going to happen.
  • name99 - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    "One of the other features that was announced for multiple Snapdragon SoCs at the 3G/LTE Summit in Hong Kong was Quick Charge 3.0, which will be supported on the Snapdragon 820, 617, and 430."

    I think QC is being somewhat unclear here. Quick Charge is a QUALCOMM technology, not a SNAPDRAGON technology, isn't it?

    Apple, for example, uses a QC PM controller that does everything described here (talk to the power brick to negotiate the voltage desired) and this works both within the Apple world (iPhone charges faster if you use the heftier iPad power brick) and using third party "Android" chargers.

    It would be interesting (something for AnandTech to check...) to see if Apple is using a Quick Charge 3.0 PMIC in the iPhone 6S. When that's connected to a high power charger, maybe it'll charge faster than an iPhone6?
  • toyotabedzrock - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Why not just use two separate cells in the battery paired with a charge controller that can charge the cells in series and run the SOC with the cells in parallel.
  • extide - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    Why bother, why not just charge the cells in parallel? I mean you're not gaining anything doing it your way except making it complicated... Just a little buck converter to get the charging voltage and done.
  • melgross - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    No matter how these companies implement this, it's going to shorten the life of the battery. Lithium batteries are very sensitive to charge. It's been a problem from the beginning.
  • JeffFlanagan - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    As long as the battery lasts two years, most people will be fine with increased battery wear as a tradeoff for fast charging. Some of us will be fine with one year. Phone companies will replace the battery, and sell the phone used, when the phone is exchanged for a newer model.
  • melgross - Tuesday, September 15, 2015 - link

    The word "lasts" is elastic. Most phone batteries will hold a 70% charge after 2 years. What if that's 70% after one year?
  • Inoperative - Sunday, September 20, 2015 - link

    No, it's not impossible to implement fast charging capabilities without compromising on lifespan of the battery.

    Like Oppo did with VOOC, they put two Li-Po cells in parallel, and after my calculation that matches the per cell charge intensity you'd see with a single cell pack.

    That's why I've been fond of VOOC, it works brilliantly in reality too, making it the fastest charging phone on the market.

    It's nice to see Quick Charge 3.0 though, but unless they are using the same strategy of putting the cells in parallel, I totally agree that it's not very fortunate.

    As far as I know the OEMs can to a greater extent tweak QC how they want, whereas VOOC being a more closely defined spec. I'd really like Oppo to make some effort in making the VOOC an open standard competing with QC, because as of now the VOOC charger is only good for Oppo devices.

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